Father Of Fallen Marine Testifies Against Westboro Baptists
Don’t even get me started on the Westboro Baptist Pukes…
~Bash
BALTIMORE — The father of a Marine killed in Iraq took the stand in his invasion of privacy suit against a fundamentalist church that pickets soldiers’ funerals, saying protesters carrying signs at his son’s burial made him sick to his stomach.
Albert Snyder said Wednesday he had hoped for a private funeral for his son, Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder.
“They turned this funeral into a media circus and they wanted to hurt my family,” Snyder testified. “They wanted their message heard and they didn’t care who they stepped over. My son should have been buried with dignity, not with a bunch of clowns outside.”
LCpl Matthew Snyder KIA in Iraq.
Snyder is suing the Westboro Baptist church, whose members have picketed the funerals of military personnel killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, claiming the deaths are punishment for the country’s tolerance of homosexuality. The York resident is seeking unspecified monetary damages in the case for invasion of privacy and intent to inflect emotional distress as a result of the Topeka, Kan., church’s protest at his son’s funeral in Westminster in March 2006.
The church’s protests have inspired several state laws and a federal law about funeral protests, but the Maryland suit is believed to be the first filed by the family of a fallen serviceman.
Asked Wednesday about a sign that read “Thank God for dead soldiers,” Snyder said he thinks about it daily.
“I see that sign when I lay in bed,” Snyder said.
Asked about statements issued by the group that his son was raised to support the “Roman Catholic monstrosity” and then sent to fight for the “United States of Sodomy,” Snyder said “they have no right to do this to people they didn’t know.”
During cross-examination, defense attorney Jonathan Katz focused on obituaries and death notices and questioned Snyder on whether they said the funeral services were private. Snyder replied that the notices said friends and family were welcome, but admitted that he did not know all of the 500 or so people who attended.
The case tests the limits of the First Amendment right to free speech.
U.S. District Court Judge Richard Bennett instructed jurors at the start of testimony Tuesday that the First Amendment protection of free speech has limits, including vulgar, offensive and shocking statements. Bennett said the jurors must decide “whether the defendant’s actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person, whether they were extreme and outrageous, and whether these actions were so offensive and shocking as to not be entitled to First Amendment protection.”
Church members said they are motivated by the fear of God and their need to warn America about its moral decay, rather than a desire to hurt anyone.
Katz told jurors Tuesday the protests took place 1,000 feet away from St. John Catholic Church, where the funeral was held, down a hill and out of sight and hearing from participants.
Snyder said American military personnel are in Iraq fighting for freedom of speech “they’re not fighting for hate speech.” One photo showing a child holding a sign at the funeral protest was particularly disturbing, the father said.
“I pray for their children. Their children need help. To be brought up with that kind of hatred,” Snyder said.
“My God is loving God,” Snyder said, adding later “I don’t look for hatred in the Bible.”
The church’s founder and pastor, Fred Phelps, took the stand after Snyder and prompted a strong admonition from Bennett when the pastor said he had not considered whether children would see a sign carried by protesters with the words “Semper Fi Fags” and two stick figures that appear to be engaged in sodomy.
“No, it’s an irrelevancy,” Phelps said.
Bennett then interjected sharply.
“Just answer the question, sir. Don’t determine what’s relevant or not relevant. You just answer the question,” Bennett said.
Phelps said he chose to use the term “fag” in the group’s signs because it comes from scripture but could also have used Sodomite or dog. When asked by Katz why the group made a “Semper Fi Fags” sign, Phelps said it was in response to the need for a warning to the country “that your wicked ways are going to be your doom shortly.”
(Evening Sun)
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It pisses me off to no end as a Christian (Baptist specifically) when I see these so-called “Christian/Baptist” groups coming out and trying to tell everyone what God really says. It is obvious these people know nothing of what Jesus spoke about…
October 30th, 2007 at 8:38 amFrom a Fundamental Baptist Christian:
Please do not believe the description of this church as “Fundamentalist”. I have been a born-again Christian for over 25 years, and a member of several Independent Baptist Churches since then, trained for over 5 1/2 years in a Fundamental Baptist Bible College and Seminary, and am now an Independent Baptist Bible Translation Missionary (since 2001).
No one in the Fundamental Baptist circles that I know would have anything to do with this nutty group. We would agree that God hates the sin of homosexuality, and that God will judge America for its sins, but going out and attacking our brave soldiers is inexcusable and unforgivable. Fundamental Baptists across America support and pray for the success of our troops.
The Bible tells us to pray for our leaders (I Timothy 2:1-4) and to be good citizens of the country that we live in (I Peter 2:13-16); and that includes being willing to join the Armed Forces and defend their nation. I can’t imagine why any Bible-believing Christian would NOT pray for and support our valiant troops, especially when they have given their lives for our freedom. The so-called “Westboro Baptist Church” is an extremely small minority, I can assure you. Please do not tar all Fundamental Christians with their ungodly brush.
Sincerely,
October 30th, 2007 at 8:41 amMax Day
TLHS Publishing Ministries
www.thekingdombible.org
I hope to God the jury in this case finds these defendants guilty of all they are charged with. We need to stand against the extremeists, including all those who protest in America against America. We need to let them know that they will no longer be able to take America hostage by spreading their hate and propaganda. They are taking Freedom of Speech way, way too far. I commend this family for filing this lawsuit during this very difficult time. I pray that by filing suit, this family they will set the presidence that this type of behavior will no longer be tolerated in America! God bless this family and all the others whose loved ones have sacrificed their lives for our country.
October 30th, 2007 at 8:55 amThis makes me want to exercise my first ammendment rights and freely express myself by walking over to these assholes and opening up a can of whoop-ass for the entire group.
October 30th, 2007 at 9:00 amTears actually came to my eyes when reading about these sick demented bastards and the impact that was felt by the Snyder’s.
I’m so glad that the Snyder family has brought suit against these fake-phony, low-life “Christians.”
Max and Seth….we know who the real Christians are and you guys have nothing to worry about!
October 30th, 2007 at 9:06 amI hope the jury awards every last dime they have. These are the same people that intended to show up at the funerals of those little Amish girls who were murdered (only to call them whores, etc.) until some radio station made a deal with them that if they didn’t go to the little Amish girls funerals they would let them rant and spew on air for an hour. Hateful people. They will get theirs whether in this life or the next. As I see it, there are ten simple rules in life. If we all followed them, life would be so much simpler.
October 30th, 2007 at 9:42 amI think we are looking at this entirely the wrong we. Instead of suing those assholes, we should DE-CRIMINALIZE action against them. I think it would be hilarious to see those whack=jobs get their asses stomped by a mob of pissed-off bikers and Marines. Just make sure to have a video camera ready and upload to YouTube so we can enjoy.
October 30th, 2007 at 9:49 amI’ve had a run in with these SOB’s before. I had to be physically restrained and reminded that they thrive off lawsuits. Most of the top members are lawyers and they fund their crap with their court winnings.
I’m ashamed to say they are from the state I was born in and call home.
October 30th, 2007 at 10:16 amSlightly OT, but, related. The Westboro witches are supposed to show up in DC for the anniversary of the Vietnam War Memorial. This is the weekend of 10-11 Nov. I learned to carry pepper spray to anti-war demonstrations. Had to discretely threaten to use it against this little collection of thugs on the Capitol Grounds 15 Sep. They backed the fuck up. I promise to only have two beers at Union Station, I’ll be in control by the time I get to the Memorial. If I have three I might not be responsible, but, then I’m just a wacky Vietnam veteran. Won’t be the first time I did an over night. It would be worth it to see Fred Phelps with a face full of pepper. It has a very tight shot group, very aimable, it’s not a spray. It’s a smart pepper spray.
Irish Gal, that was Mike Gallagher that turned his show over to them.
October 30th, 2007 at 10:28 amJohn still acting as a “taxi driver” ?
October 30th, 2007 at 10:51 amFranchie, no. When my license expired in Nov ‘02 I also “hung up my keys”. Believe me, it was no act. Finally after 18 years and four guns to the head, the latest Oct ‘02 I’d had enough. If I’m ever in a taxi for the rest of my life I’ll be in the back seat.
October 30th, 2007 at 11:02 amReading this article and seeing that picture instantly put me in tears. I cannot imagine taking something as private as a funeral and tramping my personal beliefs over someone’s grief. I take offense as a sister to the Marine Corps, as a Catholic, and, not to be ignored, as a lover of the Constitution. This group clearly infringes on the rights of the Lance’s family.
There is no need to parade at funerals when every street corner allows them the same freedom. They’d get just as many people seeing their drivel if they stood in Dupont Circle.
“Bennett said the jurors must decide “whether the defendant’s actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person”
As a reasonable person, I must say that these are highly offensive. That image will continue to haunt me — and it wasn’t my brother who was so defiled.
To John Cunningham: I don’t think anyone would blame you if you did lose it. If I were there, I’d turn away and claim ignorance. Thank you for your dedication & service to this great nation.
October 30th, 2007 at 11:02 amFranchie, all the “taxi drivers” in my large midwestern city are towel heads… Don’t believe John fits into this category. I would say he is a typical American…. Yes John, thank you for your service…
October 30th, 2007 at 11:55 amHere we have an excellent example of the self-policing nature of Christianity. One self-labeled sect of Christianity goes ape and the entirety of Christendom protests vehemently against their abuse of Christian doctrine.
Compare this to Islam. So far, only a handful of Muslims have had the balls to condemn the long-standing flood of violence perpetrated by their nutcases. The silent majority look on with what can only be described as tacit approval.
Instead of despairing at what Christianity has fallen to, this is an excellent moment to rejoice in the piety of Christendom in having the courage to condemn one of its “own” for heresy.
*Forgive my use of the word heresy but no other word can describe Phelps’ theology.
October 30th, 2007 at 11:59 amI would agree Humble, however, these lunatics are not Christians, they are just evil people pretending to be Christians….
October 30th, 2007 at 12:43 pmI cannot put into words my feelings towards these “Christians”. I can only imagine the restraint those at the funeral needed. Those Westboro Baptists aren’t worthy to be within 1000 miles of that Marine’s grave
October 30th, 2007 at 12:57 pmI am an ordained Baptist Pastor, and nothing makes me more sick than hearing more about the Westboro whack-jobs. That they have any voice in the media is only due to the left’s own rabid desire to point out anybody even remotely conservative-looking that dissents on the war in Iraq. 50 million set free is good enough for me. I hope the courts shut these false teachers up and down. This last Sunday, in the morning service, in the bulletin, and in the announcements powerpoint we honored the memory of a New York native, Lt. Michael Murphy. A little more than a year ago, we also honored Lcpl. Jason Dunham. We don’t fool around when it comes to our freedoms. We meet freely for church services and enjoy religious because of the sacrifice of others, and we ARE NOT ABOUT TO FORGET the debt of gratitude we owe this country, and the God of Eternity who gave us the opportunity to live here.
Sincerly,
October 30th, 2007 at 1:04 pmPastor Jason Walker
You all do know that Phelps is a huge backer of AlGore and YawnScary, tight? True CONservatives .
October 30th, 2007 at 1:42 pmThese people are neither Baptists nor born-again, nor conservatives. They are white-washed sepuchers filled with dead men’s bones. I hope I never run into them. It’d be worth the 24-hours just to open up a can of whoop-ass on Phred and his whores. That day is comming. People are sick of these pukes.
October 30th, 2007 at 2:50 pmI have often wondered if the real purpose of these abominations isn’t just to gain attention but to try their best to give credibility to the Christian bashing media and ACLU types.
Vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord is one of the most difficult verses in the entire Bible. I’m trying my best to wait…
October 30th, 2007 at 3:28 pmHumble Janoslav - “Compare this to Islam. So far, only a handful of Muslims have had the balls to condemn the long-standing flood of violence perpetrated by their nutcases.” You’re right!
I had the good fortune to exchange emails with Irshad Manji the author of “The Trouble With Islam Today” - I assure you all….if we had more people like her around, in all religions, we’d be writing about something else. As Irshad wrote to me, “….we’re slowly turning this ship around.”
October 30th, 2007 at 3:48 pmMike-libnotsr makes a great point. The criticism of Islamic terrorism by Islamics is deafingly quiet. Yet even in here when a so-called Christian organization like Fred Phelps group shows up on the scene, the criticism leveled against such false teachers is very loud. Let no one be confused, there is nothing righteous or Christian about Fred Phelps and big-mouth whores. They are apostates, and liars.
Fucktards like Freddy the Freeloader Phelps and the Islamo-facists have much in common. They’re both facists and should be defeated by any means.
October 30th, 2007 at 4:10 pmDamn it John just give me the pepper spray and I’ll be your point man….Be careful if your in a stuper because you’ll have to step over the unconscious, and or the blind.
If your lost, just listen for the call sign “Don’t taze me bro”
October 30th, 2007 at 6:10 pmThose people are vile and inhumane…I have no problem with someone punching the F* out of that sign holder, I mean that mneesanger from G.d
October 30th, 2007 at 6:52 pmPhelps said it was in response to the need for a warning to the country “that your wicked ways are going to be your doom shortly.”
They really are disgusting twisted people. They do not stand for any group or any type of Christians that I have ever known.
I can only hope that this group of lunatics and their hate speak will find their organization of hate doomed because of their wicked ways post haste. Low life bastards.
October 30th, 2007 at 7:05 pmLCpl Matthew Snyder May he rest in peace.
Prayers for all of Matthew Snyder’s family.
Nobody should ever have to go through such a hateful display that they saw on the day they laid their son to rest.
October 30th, 2007 at 7:10 pmJim, thank you, I have two. No bigger than your hand and each has enough for 6 or 8 shots.
October 30th, 2007 at 8:35 pmMax and humble,
take the opportunity given you and get as many fundementalist christians as you can(thousands) and make a roadtrip to westboro baptist or wherever these idiots will be next and stage a massive counterprotest as an example to muslims who never do anything substantial to counter the extremist muslims who have denigrated their faith and as a testament to non fundemntalist christians that you arent just saying you dont agree but are willing to show it in a tangible way.
In fact what agreat way to unify the country against these bigots and show the world that we are not like thinking with these people, and advertise this counterprotest to ALL like minded people who are tired of the bigotry of these fascists in our own back yard.
Ive seen groups confront code pink, now is the time to confront these people. Imagine a group of people drowning out the message of their voices with songs of praise to jesus, and a group of people blocking funeral mourners from the view of their insulting signs. they may be free to repeat their bigotry but we are alo free to counter it.
October 31st, 2007 at 4:30 am