Man With CCW Not Charged In Headshot - As It Should Be
Apparently the attacker with the garbage can and the shooter had a history and the shooter had a valid CCW and there will be no charges files in the case. Chalk one up for the right to defend yourself. Just wish I could have seen the guy actually drop. Looks like he realized he had been shot and was stunned. He died of course.
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What a stupid ass bringing a garbage can to a gun fight!
GET YOUR GUN LICENSES FOLKS, IT LOOKS LIKE WE WILL HAVE TO DEFEND OURSELVES THE OLD FASHIONED WAY!
ESPECIALLY AFTER LISTENING TO THE POST WHERE THE PATRIOT WAS TALKING TO MUSLIMS IN THE CHAT ROOMS & LAW ENFORCEMENT IS TO POLITICALLY CORRECT TO TAKE ACTION!
GET READY! MOBILIZE!
ESPECIALLY IF HUSSEIN WINS IN NOVEMBER!
March 29th, 2008 at 1:05 pmLooks like it was the shooter that ended up “Taking Out The Trash” in the end!
March 29th, 2008 at 2:29 pmLooks pretty cut and dry to me. One shot, one kill. Good job. And he had a CCW too. Smart guy…
March 29th, 2008 at 2:40 pmThat guy had a death wish…
One shot to the head will normally stop any confrontation.
March 29th, 2008 at 6:02 pmWell, I’m sure this will piss some people off, but this looks like excessive force to me. Very excessive since it resulted in an unnecessary death in my opinion.
I can only go by what I see on the vid so my comment comes with that caveat. It is of course possible that there’s a lot more going on than what is shown.
The only way I think their “history” means much…is if the guy with the trash can had pulled a gun on the other guy earlier in the day. But he didn’t pull one out in this confrontation, so that might make it a moot point as far as the law is concerned.
I have to admit, I find it hard to believe that anyone is afraid of a trash can in one hand, and what looks like either a bag or piece of newspaper in the other. Not to mention, the guy with the trash can looks slow and clumsy. Unless you are REALLY out of shape, don’t know any combatives at all (how to fight), or you’re infirm in some way, then this kind of situation should not threaten you to the point where you feel it’s necessary to use deadly force.
I mean really, the other guy could have found his own trash can, and they could have proceeded to try to beat on each other with trash cans like a couple of silly fairies (like their own personal rendition of a butched up pillow fight) until the cops showed up. It would’ve been more entertaining to watch too.
Seriously though, the guy is holding something harmless in his left hand, so that hand is, for all intents and purposes, occupied and not in the fight. And in the other hand he is drawing back a frickin’ trash can for God’s sake. It’s not a 12″ knife, or an axe or even a baseball bat (which is easy to avoid / disarm). It would be extremely easy to land a kick to the balls, or a punch to the solar plexus while his trash can arm is drawn back or up almost over his head trying to swing the can. One punch Solar Plexus, one kick balls = dumbass on the ground long enough to be able to easily flip him on his stomach, apply an arm bar and hold him until a cop shows up.
And what if you did get hit with that trash can? I couldn’t imagine it hurting very much. It would just make you really pissed. Even someone out of shape should have been able to put this guy down without too much effort in my opinion.
I will say I do think it’s good that the CCW holder didn’t get in trouble. That would have set a bad precedent. And I’m definitely not saying that there aren’t circumstances where it IS necessary to shoot to kill to defend yourself, your loved ones, or someone who can’t defend themselves. But this doesn’t fall into any of those categories in my opinion.
March 29th, 2008 at 11:17 pmOn a lighter note, tomorrow is range day. I have a new Les Baer 1911 to break in.
March 29th, 2008 at 11:29 pmLocal news accounts (FWIW):
http://www.wzzm13.com/news/local/grmetro_article.aspx?storyid=87893
http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=88045
http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=89756
http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=89794
Gabriel Rodriguez’s corrections record:
http://www.state.mi.us/mdoc/asp/otis2profile.asp?mdocNumber=181585
A shooting just begins with the shot.
March 30th, 2008 at 12:45 pmGood links, thanks.
Wow…while I don’t think the victim was a “model” citizen, those articles definitely reinforce my previous opinion. They make it clear in my mind that excessive force was used. To the point where I now think the court should relook into prosecuting the shooter for manslaughter, even though I hate the possibily of negative repercussions in terms of precedent that might be set in regard to CCW permits if he was convicted.
According to the victims prison record, he was a petty criminal. He had some problems with cocaine addiction, and a single B&E (probably to obtain money to be able to buy drugs). No murder, rape, assault / battery, etc, charges. In other words, nothing violent.
He was physically small - 5′7″ and 145 lbs and not a young buck anymore (48 years old). And the article(s) said he “assaulted” the shooter with a 4 lb trash can lid. A trash can lid…UNBELIEVABLE. Not a gun, or a knife, or an axe, or a baton, or nunchakus, or a Bo, or fighting sticks, or a sword, or a baseball bat…a trash can lid!
I can’t believe any adult male (which the shooter was) in their right mind would be scared enough, or feel threatened enough in this situation, to pull a gun instead of just administering a good old fashioned ass kicking. OR, why not just get in your vehicle and drive away before the situation escalated? The shooter clearly had multiple options other than using deadly force.
How can a person (no one specific, so don’t take offense) who feels so threatened and scared by someone like this, or an 11 year old girl for that matter, even walk out of their house in the morning to pick up the paper without peeing their pants? I mean really, aren’t you afraid a spider might cross your path and you’d have to run and get your wife to kill it for you?
Sorry if that sounds a bit harsh, but this is just ridiculous in my opinion. If you have to use force, it’s correct application in these kind of situations is using only enough force to get the job done.
Having said that, there ARE situations where I would use deadly force without a doubt. But this surely isn’t one.
My recommendation for people who are this scared of and feel so threatened by situations like this, is to learn combatives. If you don’t want to invest a lot of time, go and take a couple months of Krav Maga classes. It is one of the fastest ways to gain competency in self defense. Learn how to punch and kick correctly, and then practice on a heavy bag as if you were in a real fight, 3-4 times per week for 20 minutes. You will gain self confidence, self discipline and control, and subsequently, your threat assessment ability will be enhanced. Plus, you’ll be stronger and healthier, and that’s always a good thing. That goes for the ladies too of course.
March 30th, 2008 at 9:21 pm